I have two questions: age difference and avoiding scammers/liars.

by Chanahan
(Dallas, TX USA)

I am 51 years old and in very good shape and people guess that I am about 40. Its due to genes (my dad looked very young) and clean living (no drugs ever, no smoking ever, and not much alcohol). I was married for 24 years (got married young), but am widowed now. My children are adults and out of the house. I have a high education (undergraduate degree, Ivy League MBA) and have (and do) travel extensively for business. I earn a high income (~$500K per year) and therefore have enough assets to pursue someone pretty much anywhere and am financially secure. I am very family oriented and that is one reason why I would consider a woman from Ukraine as they are very family oriented. I have no problem with a woman who has or even wants children.

The age question: While I do not want to pursue a woman in her 20s or even early/mid 30s, is it OK to pursue a woman in her late 30s given my age? I tend to have the energy and physical activity of someone much younger than myself. I do not want a party girl.

The scammer question: I have read about people getting scammed and would not fall for the "I need money for my father who is in the hospital" line, but I am concerned that some women are looking only for financial security and I could find myself falling for a good "actress" and waste 6 months and a lot of money to find out. I don't want to be a target simply because of my income and assets. How can I best avoid getting scammed?

Bob's Comment:

Funny, the answer to the age question has some overlap with the income/scam question :) If you have enough money and can provide a good enough life, then they don't care as much about age. Obviously.

But seriously, at 51, good shape, and let's just say "financially secure", aiming for a woman in her late 30s is extremely realistic and reasonable. And the best reason for not looking for someone under 30 isn't so much because of the age DIFFERENCE, but just the age PERIOD. Women under 30, especially those without children already, are more likely to have extremely idealistic views of life. Just my opinion.

The tour director of the only AFA tour I ever took was 50, but very "young-ish", energetic, and charismatic. He dated and married a 25 year old Russian lady who already had a daughter. Last time I spoke with them they were still together and very happy. He did have a bit of an unfair advantage though in that he WORKED IN RUSSIA for the same company (AFA) as the girl did, so they were able to spend a lot more time together in very natural circumstances to get to know each other.

Scammer Question: It's a valid concern, and I'm aware of at least one such story (Russian supermodel-like woman marries American accountant, gets pregnant, threatens to abort the baby if he doesn't buy her a much more expensive house!).

Since my income isn't really at the level that makes me a big target I can only speculate as to a good approach to the problem. But I have thought about this before and think there's a pretty simple solution. DON'T LET THEM KNOW ABOUT YOUR WEALTH/INCOME/STANDARD OF LIVING, at least not in the beginning.

DOWNPLAY your wealth and income. Act, live, talk, and present yourself like a guy who earns $80K-$100K... Don't talk about having the means and freedom to travel often. When you visit there stay in mid or lower-budget lodging, don't buy expensive gifts, think of ways of explaining what you do that don't make it real clear that you earn a lot, etc., etc., etc.

If a girl doesn't know you have income and wealth worthy of the acting job, then it seems logical that there would be a lower risk of her having ulterior motives.

You don't have to directly lie, just downplay, be ambiguous.

If I ever came across a winning $170 million Powerball ticket I think that's how I'd handle it :)

Oh, you might want to consider strategies for protecting your assets in the sad event that things do go bad.

I hope that helps!

If you have any follow up questions/comments to this, please just add a comment to this post and I'll answer (if needed).

Comments for I have two questions: age difference and avoiding scammers/liars.

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Two Questions
by: Dale

Obviously, the first step is to not use a pay per letter service. I think you could easily focus on girls of thirty something, with or without children. They tend to be more serious. Late twenties maybe, if they seem mature. Not younger. Don't wear the Rolex when you go to meet. If you choose to stay in a nice hotel, tell them you had points to use. Definitely don't show pictures of your house, or stuff. Some are very good, and the scam request comes far down the line.

I think even a lady with a child and over 35 can just be looking for money, you will know eventually.

by: Chanahan

Bob, thanks for the advice. I would not consider someone under 30 for sure and not likely under 35 – God bless the AFA tour director with the 25 year old wife! As far as wealth is concerned, I am pretty low key anyway and am cognizant of it when I travel to Europe in general. I will not try to display wealth (I will leave my "Rolex" home as Dale suggests).

I was thinking of simply making a trip to Kiev and possibly Odessa (would like to see the Black Sea) without actually having any dates set up just to get a feel for the country. I have business in Europe regularly and it would not be difficult to get there. Do you think that is a good idea or simply start with setting up dates? Also, are the women expecting marriage proposals after meeting for only a couple of weeks? I am a bit old fashioned in that I would want to date someone for some time (less now than when I was 25) before asking them to marry.

You're welcome
by: Bob

You're welcome!

I like the idea of just traveling there to get a little familiar with the country sounds like a great idea.

As you probably read, I personally believe one of two approaches are best:

1) Write women you meet online, narrow down to one, and visit ONLY her. The very first time I attempted that approach I found a wife! Don't celebrate yet, we're divorced now, but it wasn't a result of the approach.

2) Don't write anyone and JUST GO on an individual tour. This second option is in need of some re-write with the death of the Angelika Network as they were practically the only option for that approach.

But frankly these two approaches are mostly geared around the fact that most Americans just don't have the flexibility to go there very often. Both work, but both have limitations that don't really exist for someone who can get there more frequently and easily.

As for the specific questions...

The easier question: Do they expect quick marriage proposals? No (and you should worry about any who do).

Is it good to set up dates on your first trip? I can see how this could work well either way.

The idea that you're willing to just go without planning dates takes a LOT of pressure off. It could be a very enjoyable trip and you could end up actually meeting someone much more serendipitously.

But the good thing is that you don't even really need to decide in advance. You can just go, and if you do a little sightseeing and find yourself bored, THEN you can set up dates. You can try to do it yourself by just contacting women online, or you can go to an agency.

In Kiev I can't say enough good things about Daisy Bride (and no, I don't get a commission, but do mention that I sent you anyway just in case it helps me get better deals later :)

One of their rotating banners on the home page really hits home for a situation like this, "It takes us ten minutes to find you a date for tonight!" (to be clear: This is a DATE, not prostitution! So dinner, tea, coffee, etc... Just saying because "It takes us ten minutes to find you a date for tonight" might come off a little differently than they mean it).

And you can actually use their tour package for $180/day (min 5 days). That includes (1) airport pickup/drop off, (2) furnished apartment right in the center, (3) guidance (Oksana will answer any question any time day or night... "where do I buy milk?", "where is a good place in the center to take a girl to lunch?", "where can I buy medicine?", etc.), AND (4) unlimited "intros".

Ignore #4 for the moment... $180/day is worth it for 1, 2, and 3. And if you want dates, just tell Oksana who you want to meet (their database is online) and she'll contact them to try to set it up (if the girl accepts). And Oksana knows ALL the girls in her database, so when you see someone you like, ask Oksana what she's really like. She WILL tell you... including if the girl is a gold digger.

If you are on sites that allow communication (NOT pay-per-letter) and you strike up good dialog with girls in Kiev I would not hesitate to mention that you'll be in Kiev and would like to meet, and try to set that up yourself. But it's usually the case that dates set up by the third party are more reliable (they more often SHOW UP, and ON TIME). When that third party isn't involved the girls can be VERY unreliable.

Anyway, all this talk about Kiev makes me want to book a trip!

I just don't know...
by: K.C.T.

This article has been quite interesting. I am a 58 year old male who has retired versus go through the battle of excessive travel, filing taxes in numerous states, etc. I do not make an exorbitant retirement income, but I am comfortable, stable, and secure in my single lifestyle. I am organized, prepared and set stable for the rest of my life.

I am quite attracted to women of Slavic/Russian/Ukrainian decent, but hesitate to pursue and become involved.

Call it distance, call it culture, call it age, life barriers, but I just do not seem to want to create something that is not real, face-to-face, and genuine.

I am well-off. I am looking for a woman who is younger. Younger meaning half my age (29) plus 7.

I am a realist. 36-54 would suit me, but has a man like me have a chance to enjoy, desire, and flourish with a beautiful Slavic younger woman?

Bob's response to K.C.T.
by: Bob

I'm glad you found THIS article interesting because it has all the information you need... including that bit about going over there talking about being "well-off" :) You might as well go out on Kreschatik Street (Kiev's "5th Ave") and throw fist fulls of $100 bills in the air.

But really I think your chances would have to be pretty good, especially as you would be targeting a 36-54 year old woman there. Now if you're an "old 58" you may be forced to the higher end of that target range, but otherwise it's extremely realistic.

As for those distance/culture/age/etc. barriers, aren't you kind of in an almost ideal situation to be able to safely overcome some of those with some "extended travel" in Ukraine? If you're retired, have a comfortable income, etc., why not?

I'll eventually get around to writing some more thoughts on this, but my gut tells me there's a better approach to this pursuit than any of those commonly promoted, including on this website (tour approach vs individual tour, etc.)... I may be forced to come up with a better name for my "new" approach (the one my gut tells me about), but for now let's just call it the get-your-butt-over-there approach :)

It goes like this... Find a way to free yourself from rigid geographical constraints (i.e. if you're a self-employed I.T. guy like me, anywhere there's a high speed internet connection is an acceptable work location, or if you're RETIRED...) pack up and go to Ukraine and spend a month or two at a time. Write women online WHILE YOU'RE THERE (ideally in the same city where you are). When they say they aren't interested in long correspondence but only "real meeting", say "How bout lunch at T.G.I. Friday's by the Besarabsky Market Friday at noon?" (assuming you're in Kiev)

This eases all those concerns about things/people not being real or genuine.

And besides, and although maybe it's not for everyone, EVERYONE I have ever met that has spent time in Ukraine can't wait to go back. You might even like it so much that you'll enjoy going there just to hang out even if meeting women wasn't the central theme (and frankly, THAT is often the kind of scenario where meeting THE ONE is most likely as it gets all that pressure off everyone).

Anyway, stay tuned. I need to road test my new theory :)

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